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I was part of a team building a complex web gui. We started the project in 2015. The GUI had a _lot_ of cascading business logic, an editable high-density grid, all kinds of fun.

In our tools evaluation, React just had too much overhead. changes would trigger a huge cascade of events that killed responsiveness. We went with Backbone and it served us very well.

I know React is king, but so far I have managed to live without it.


East Jerusalem is ... not a nut anyone here is going to crack.

What do those folks want for themselves? Be part of the Palestinian Authority? (Not the ones I have been doing a remodel with.) Make them part of Jordan?

Jerusalem is disputed territory. That makes it an uncomfortable mess, for more or less everyone.

The region needs more efforts toward peace, and less black and white, good/bad labeling.

East Jerusalemites are in limbo waiting for peace.

It's Jerusalem. It's a strange place.


- There is only one Israeli citizenship. Jews have it. Israeli Arab Muslims have it. Israeli Arab Christians have it. Druze have it. It's the same.

Is there discrimination, in all directions? Yup. The world is a tribal place.

But you should move on from that "tiered" thing. I live here. I have been doing a project with Arabs for the last two weeks. We have lunch together most days. Move on.

- Constitution -- You clearly have not read the constitutions of Syria, Saudi Arabia, or many other countries. Ethnic groups are all over the identities of most of the world's countries.

- Automatic citizenship - How narrow do you define this? African Americans can go to Liberia and other countries of Africa. Until just twenty years ago or so anyone with a German grandparent could automatically get German citizenship. If you are Cuban you can get American citizenship. Are you thinking this through?

- NPT, I am not sure anyone cares, but this is very different than your other topics.


> But you should move on from that "tiered" thing. I live here. I have been doing a project with Arabs for the last two weeks. We have lunch together most days. Move on.

As convincing as your lunch anecdote is, I'm not sure you're can hand waive away the problem so easily.

From https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Israel

A March 2010 poll by Tel Aviv University found that 49.5% of Israeli Jewish high school students believe Israeli Arabs should not be entitled to the same rights as Jews in Israel

An October 2010 poll by the Dahaf polling agency found that 36% of Israeli Jews favor eliminating voting rights for non-Jews

A 2012 poll revealed widespread support among Israeli Jews for discrimination against Israeli Arabs, including 33% of respondents believing Israeli Arabs should be denied the right to vote, 42% objecting to their children going to the same schools as Arabs, and 49% "[wanting] the state to treat Jews better than Arabs"

And on and on and on...


That is polling, that isn't reality.

I live here. In places like Jerusalem, Jews and Arabs are together all day, every day. 40% of the police officers in Jerusalem are Arabs.

What is your problem?

Why do you selectively omit the polls of Arabs and Palestinians... about lots of things.... (attitudes to Jews, support of violent Jihadist groups, etc etc)

If you want peace, push for peace.

If you want violence and blood, keep doing what you are doing.


> What is your problem?

My problem is that Isreal is killing innocent people every day and I want them to stop it. Their horrible record of human rights violations is undeniable.

So I'm sorry if this colors my view of Israelis treatment of non-Jewish people within Israel and makes polls like the one's I cited easy to believe. But you're right I don't live there so I don't know the ground truth.

> If you want peace, push for peace.

That's exactly what I want. How do you suggest I push for it then? Because from where I sit, a good start is to be critical of (or at to least stop supporting) the biggest perpetrator of civilian death on the planet.


That is two random youtubers.

You know better than to listen to rants on line... I hope!


I posted that because it was illustrative and the podcasters used the same phrase, without any shame or compunction.

Here’s a survey conducted by Israeli researchers showing that vast majority (82%) of Israelis surveyed support forcibly expelling Palestinians.

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-06-03/ty-article/.p...


Israelis are brutalized, by the actions of Hamas and at having no choice but to fight Hamas in horrible circumstances.

Hamas could have ended the war in Gaza a year ago. Or on October 8 2023.

Do they? No. They will fight to the last Gazan child.

Is it nice that Israelis see no alternative to Gazans being resettled elsewhere? No.

Do you have a path for Gazans to go back to the mid 1990's when 100+ Gazans came to Kibbutz Nir Oz for a peace festival?


> Israelis are brutalized, by the actions of Hamas and at having no choice but to fight Hamas in horrible circumstances.

No matter how many times I see it, the constant shifting goalposts and lack of self awareness will always startle me.


I am not saying it is good or desirable.

Do you live in a place that has a death cult committing daily acts of violence and killing (against people on both sides of the fence, of both "ethnicities")?

Do you live in a place where billions are spent on offensive weapons (tunnels, rockets) and stolen from donated food aid (as Hamas has been hijacking aid for many years and selling it at profit)?

If you do not, do you have any idea how a group of people (e.g. a society) responds to ongoing violence and threats of violence?

Your dismissive "constant shifting goalposts and lack of self awareness will always startle me" is the mark of someone who sits in an armchair and experiences no threat.

Beware of being dismissive. This region needs people who push for the hard work of peace and avoid labels and dismisiveness.

There was a peace movement in the 1990s. It accomplished a lot (a million+ Palestinians live under a Palestinian government in the West Bank and Gaza was left to its own devices in 2005).

A death cult (probably two) killed that process. By killing people (including the Israeli Prime Minister). Years earlier, that death cult killed Sadat for his peace making work.

Support those who push for peace.

Call out those who don't.


Can you explain a genocide in Gaza or the West Bank both of which have growing Palestinian populations even during wartime?

(If you correct for the 100K+ who left Gaza before Egypt closed its border in 2024)


Inventing is explaining now? Ah…


Inventing what, exactly?

The population growth rate in the West Bank and Gaza is higher than that of Europe.

I ain't the one having the babies... The residents of those places are.


And what is the life expectancy?


What is the life expectancy of a body politic that chooses ongoing offensive war?

That is not a well thought out question. The answer is different in PA controlled areas, non PA areas, and Gaza.

And Gaza's life expectancy is different for members of Hamas vs. non members. And was one thing on October 6, 2023 and October 8, 2023.

Hamas has agency.

They could end the war a year ago or tomorrow.

Why don't they?


I don't think "getting invaded" counts as "choosing offensive war".


>I don't think "getting invaded" counts as "choosing offensive war".

Do you know what Hamas is?

Do you know their charter?

Do you know that they diverted billions of $, meant to build housing for Gazans to their own pockets and to a huge underground fortress under a civilian population?

Do you know that most Gazans support Hamas, and that Hamas has made many offensive wars against the civilians and armies of both Israel and Egypt? (Hamas killed dozens of Egyptian soldiers running wild in Egyptian Rafah in 2014... Know what Egypt did? Leveled hundreds of housing structures)

Hamas has been in a state of war since the day they took power in Gaza.

Hamas has murdered hundreds of Palestinians, including many who worked for peace.

What do you want to see?

More violence and blood?

Or more peace?

Promote what you want to see.

(Digging out the 100's of miles of offensive tunnels in Gaza is slow slow work. Hamas could end the war any time, but they will never surrender. They will fight to the last Gazan child. Do you want that?)


Is palestine territory occupied or not? You wrote a novel to evade a simple fact.


It is a hasbara account, no point in talking with it.


Have you paid attention to who can hold power in, say, Iran? Or Saudi Arabia? Or Syria? Or Jordan?

Israel isn't any more apartheid than any of those places. Given that Israeli Arabs can and do vote (and become Medical Doctors), Israel is a heck of a lot _less_ apartheid than those places.

Consider travel... it can help you get outside the "american" box.


You do realize that socialists are people who kept supporting khomeini AFTER it became clear he sent snipers, during the revolution, to attack his own people (well, the students, unions, ...) just so he could claim "zionists" killed thousands of people?

Of course this government is FAR worse, including on racism, than the worst Israel has ever been accused of. It's not going to change their minds ...

The current Iranian government started blaming Israel for everything long before they were even in power. Socialists supported them back then ... and largely now.

Clearly, one is forced to conclude, they see no problem with such actions.


I think you have not paid attention to European and Middle Eastern countries.

They are all ethno states.

The very concept "nation-state" is an alignment of "ethnic tribe" with "political borders"

You might want to hit a history book or two.

In this regard, Israel is more normal and places like the U.S. are abnormal. (Once you get outside the U.S....)


The problems of Israeli democracy are not the ones you list.

The fundamental issue is the population of the West Bank, who, outside of Palestinian Authority areas (aka "Area A"), are largely controlled by Israel but cannot vote. Note that 1-2 million West Bank Palestinians live in Area A under the Palestinian Authority.

- Within Israel, there is a Communist Party (which rejects religion and ethnicity) and other parties (including two Arab parties).

- A key problem in Israeli democracy, which it would be helpful if you noted, is that although there are two Arab parties (and majority Jewish parties who welcome Arabs), the Arab population of Israel votes at a low rate. This results in their being under-represented in the Knesset.

- The Basic Law you refer to made zero change to who can have political power.

- The 50% you refer to is neither the right percentage, nor does it take into account areas of great Palestinian autonomy.

- Function of the legal system has never been relevant to who can vote or hold office.

If you want to reflect what is on the ground, I suggest you take in the whole picture.


I agree. Bombing can only "do" so much....


Evangelical Zionists who fund extremist Jews ...

Film, Til Kingdom Come -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%27Til_Kingdom_Come_(film)


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